QNX product packaging

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Dmitri Poustovalov

QNX product packaging

Post by Dmitri Poustovalov » Mon Oct 28, 2002 4:13 am

6.1 had a very decent packaging story but after blending Momentics with some
Windows innovative packaging ideas I found out my eyebrows rose high. Let me
give you an example. RPX-Lite BSP somehow was promoted to Automotive Bundle.
Now there is no way to upgrade from RPX-Lite version 6.1 to 6.2 if someone
was and is making an industrial controller based on RPX-Lite, and does not
have any intention to pay for Automotive Bundle. After all, RPX-Lite is QNX
only PPC 823 platform, the cheapest and probably the most lightweight
embedded platform in QNX portfolio. I would suggest giving away this BSP
with NC package for the same reason you are now giving NC away.



Another question is why some BSPs are not included in Professional Edition,
but included into bundles, for example, MVP, PrPMC800 and Marvell Discovery
in Networking Bundle. This packaging is confusing: does it mean Networking
Bundle works only on mentioned boards? I hope not. Could I get those BSPs
w/o Networking Bundle? I hope yes.BTW, some BSP are not included into either
package, for example IBM405GP and Broadcom BCM1250. I guess they got lost.



Let me put on my loyal-QNX-user hat and suggest repackaging. It would be
reasonable to return back to platform based packaging as it was in 6.1 For
example, if a customer is PowerPC shop, then that customer is interested in
buying PowerPC BSPs. As PowerPC shop I would like to experiment with as many
as possible _PowerPC_ BSPs and to learn from them. It is hard to expect the
same customer being interested in MIPS. If so, there would be MIPS Bundle
available. The specific niche bundles (Networking, Automotive) would include
specific features. For example, MOST and all related s/w look like a natural
part of Automotive Bundle.



There is another option that is to include all BSPs into PE. I wouldn't
mind. It is Professional Edition after all ;)



Cheers,

-Dmitri

Rennie Allen

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Rennie Allen » Mon Oct 28, 2002 9:42 am

Dmitri Poustovalov wrote:
There is another option that is to include all BSPs into PE. I wouldn't
mind. It is Professional Edition after all ;)
The BSP for the broadcom product for instance, has almost zero use
outside of telcom. Why should the general PE buyer subsidize the
telcom industry by paying for development of a BSP, that's only
useful to that industry ? The same goes for automotive. I like
the packaging approach (of course, the packaging may require some
tuning).

In theory, the bundling approach means that customers requiring
unexceptional features pay the lowest cost (as it should be). QSSL
needs to make this work in practice, by insuring that they pass
on the costs of exceptional features only to the users who require
those features.

Jay Greig

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Jay Greig » Mon Oct 28, 2002 4:49 pm

Previously, Dmitri Poustovalov wrote in qdn.public.qnxrtp.advocacy:
[snip]
There is another option that is to include all BSPs into PE. I wouldn't
mind. It is Professional Edition after all ;)
It's not a full solution, but the Supplementary Package available for PE
users contains pre-compiled drivers for all boards supported in the
Automotive and Netcom Editions. (ie. it does not include src)

--
-Jay.

Mario Charest

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Mario Charest » Mon Oct 28, 2002 5:04 pm

"Dmitri Poustovalov" <pdmitri@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:apidab$a6$1@inn.qnx.com...
6.1 had a very decent packaging story but after blending Momentics with
some
Windows innovative packaging ideas I found out my eyebrows rose high. Let
me
give you an example. RPX-Lite BSP somehow was promoted to Automotive
Bundle.
Now there is no way to upgrade from RPX-Lite version 6.1 to 6.2 if someone
was and is making an industrial controller based on RPX-Lite, and does not
have any intention to pay for Automotive Bundle. After all, RPX-Lite is
QNX
only PPC 823 platform, the cheapest and probably the most lightweight
embedded platform in QNX portfolio. I would suggest giving away this BSP
with NC package for the same reason you are now giving NC away.



Another question is why some BSPs are not included in Professional
Edition,
but included into bundles, for example, MVP, PrPMC800 and Marvell
Discovery
in Networking Bundle. This packaging is confusing: does it mean Networking
Bundle works only on mentioned boards? I hope not. Could I get those BSPs
w/o Networking Bundle? I hope yes.BTW, some BSP are not included into
either
package, for example IBM405GP and Broadcom BCM1250. I guess they got lost.



Let me put on my loyal-QNX-user hat and suggest repackaging. It would be
reasonable to return back to platform based packaging as it was in 6.1
For
example, if a customer is PowerPC shop, then that customer is interested
in
buying PowerPC BSPs. As PowerPC shop I would like to experiment with as
many
as possible _PowerPC_ BSPs and to learn from them. It is hard to expect
the
same customer being interested in MIPS. If so, there would be MIPS Bundle
available. The specific niche bundles (Networking, Automotive) would
include
specific features. For example, MOST and all related s/w look like a
natural
part of Automotive Bundle.



There is another option that is to include all BSPs into PE. I wouldn't
mind. It is Professional Edition after all ;)

It's the same as with buying a car. I want air conditionner but don't want
electric windows but I got no choice they both bundle together. Or you may
want leather seat but that is only available with the XYZ model which come
with 17 inch wheels that you don't care for. It would be nice to be able to
pick every single feature, but the complexity of handling and managing it
would probably increase the overall cost anyway, so get the XYZ mode and
bite, otherwise forget the leather and move on. Can't make everybody happy.
Cheers,

-Dmitri






Rennie Allen

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Rennie Allen » Mon Oct 28, 2002 5:09 pm

Bill Caroselli (Q-TPS) wrote:
"Mario Charest" <postmaster@127.0.0.1> wrote in message
pick every single feature, but the complexity of handling and managing it
would probably increase the overall cost anyway, so get the XYZ mode and
bite, otherwise forget the leather and move on. Can't make everybody

happy.


I completely agree with Mario. You'll never make ANYONE happy with a
bundle. Someone will always be forced to pay for something they don't
want/need. Therefore, get rid of all bundling and sell everything a la
carte.
That is counter to decades of marketing experience.

When is the last time you went to McDonalds and ordered a-la-carte ?

Packages/Bundles/Value Meals (call them what you will) are a
proven method of complexity management in retailing/marketing.

If you think it's complicated to order Momentics "meal" 1, 2, or 3,
with a side of "auto" or "telecom", try placing your order
specifying each component individually.

Rennie

Bill Caroselli (Q-TPS)

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Bill Caroselli (Q-TPS) » Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:49 pm

"Mario Charest" <postmaster@127.0.0.1> wrote in message
news:apjqbu$j36$1@inn.qnx.com...
It's the same as with buying a car. I want air conditionner but don't
want
electric windows but I got no choice they both bundle together. Or you
may
want leather seat but that is only available with the XYZ model which come
with 17 inch wheels that you don't care for. It would be nice to be able
to
pick every single feature, but the complexity of handling and managing it
would probably increase the overall cost anyway, so get the XYZ mode and
bite, otherwise forget the leather and move on. Can't make everybody
happy.
I completely agree with Mario. You'll never make ANYONE happy with a
bundle. Someone will always be forced to pay for something they don't
want/need. Therefore, get rid of all bundling and sell everything a la
carte.

Dmitri Poustovalov

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Dmitri Poustovalov » Tue Oct 29, 2002 4:53 am

"Rennie Allen" <rallen@csical.com> wrote in message
news:3DBD6F46.1000706@csical.com...
Bill Caroselli (Q-TPS) wrote:
"Mario Charest" <postmaster@127.0.0.1> wrote in message
pick every single feature, but the complexity of handling and managing
it
would probably increase the overall cost anyway, so get the XYZ mode and
bite, otherwise forget the leather and move on. Can't make everybody

happy.


I completely agree with Mario. You'll never make ANYONE happy with a
bundle. Someone will always be forced to pay for something they don't
want/need. Therefore, get rid of all bundling and sell everything a la
carte.

That is counter to decades of marketing experience.

When is the last time you went to McDonalds and ordered a-la-carte ?

Packages/Bundles/Value Meals (call them what you will) are a
proven method of complexity management in retailing/marketing.

I don't think when you buy Cheesburger (PowerPC BSP) McDonalds tells you to
also buy Double Cheesburger (Automotive Bundle), to scratch half of the
chees (RPX-Lite BSP) and to put that chees on your Cheesburger.
If you think it's complicated to order Momentics "meal" 1, 2, or 3,
with a side of "auto" or "telecom", try placing your order
specifying each component individually.

Rennie

Rennie Allen

Re: QNX product packaging

Post by Rennie Allen » Tue Oct 29, 2002 7:16 am

Dmitri Poustovalov wrote:
I don't think when you buy Cheesburger (PowerPC BSP) McDonalds tells you to
also buy Double Cheesburger (Automotive Bundle), to scratch half of the
chees (RPX-Lite BSP) and to put that chees on your Cheesburger.
I did'nt say that the bundling was "right" yet, only that there is
nothing inherently wrong with bundling :-)

Rennie

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